'The Darjeeling Limited' Connects Brothers By Rail

DATE October 1, 2007 ACCOUNT NUMBER N/A
TIME 12:00 Noon-1:00 PM AUDIENCE N/A
NETWORK NPR
PROGRAM Fresh Air

Interview: Co-writer and director Wes Anderson and co-writer and
star Jason Schwartzman on "The Darjeeling Limited," their new
film together
TERRY GROSS, host:

This is FRESH AIR. I'm Terry Gross. The new film "The Darjeeling Limited" is
directed and co-written by my guest, Wes Anderson, who also made the films
"The Royal Tenenbaums" and "Rushmore." "Rushmore" launched the acting career
of my other guest, Jason Schwartzman, who starred in that film as a prep
school misfit. Schwartzman is a co-writer of "The Darjeeling Limited" and he
stars in it along with Owen Wilson and Adrien Brody. The film opened the New
York Film Festival last week and opens in theaters Friday.

The story is about three brothers who have not spoken to each other since
their father died one year ago. Each of the brothers is lost and damaged in
his own way. Wilson's character is physically damaged after a motorcycle
accident. His face is in bandages through the film. Watching the character,
you can't help think about Wilson's recent suicide attempt. Wilson plays the
oldest of the brothers. He summons his two brothers to India and arranges for
the three of them to take a train trip together on the Darjeeling Limited.
Here's a scene just after the brothers meet on the train. Wilson's character
is welcoming his two younger brothers and explaining what the trip is all
about.

(Soundbite of "The Darjeeling Limited")

(Soundbite of music)

Mr. OWEN WILSON: (As Francis) I want to start by thanking you both for being
here.

Mr. ADRIEN BRODY: (As Peter) Thank you

Mr. JASON SCHWARTZMAN: (As Jack) Thank you

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) You're the two most important people in the world
to me. I've never said that before, but it's true and I want you both to know
it. I love you, Peter.

Mr. BRODY: (As Peter) Thank you.

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) I love you, Jack.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Jack) I love you, too.

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) How did it get to this? Why haven't we spoken in a
year? Let's make an agreement.

Mr. BRODY: (As Peter) Of what?

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) OK? A, I want us to become brothers again like we
used to be and for us to find ourselves and bond with each other. Can we
agree to that?

Mr. BRODY: (As Peter) OK.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Jack) Yeah.

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) B, I want to make this trip a spiritual journey
where each of us seek the unknown and we learn about it. We agree to that.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Jack) Sure.

Mr. BRODY: (As Peter) I guess so.

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) C, I want us to be completely open and say yes to
everything, even if it's shocking and painful. Can we agree to that? I had
Brendan make us an itinerary.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Jack) Who's Brendan?

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) My new assistant. He's going to place an updated
schedule under our doors every morning of all the spiritual places and temples
that we need to see and expedite hotels and transportation and everything.

Mr. BRODY: (As Peter) How's he going to do that?

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) I had him bring a printer and a laminating machine.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Jack) Where is he?

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) Well, that actually doesn't matter. He's in a
different compartment on another part of the train. You never see him, ever.
That's more or less it. Three, please. Does that sound OK to you?

Mr. BRODY: (As Peter) Sounds good. Sure.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Jack) Yeah, sounds good.

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) Do you have any questions?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Jack) I do.

Mr. WILSON: (As Francis) OK, go ahead.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Jack) What happened to your face?

(End of soundbite)

GROSS: Wes Anderson, Jason Schwartzman, welcome to FRESH AIR. Wes, why did
you want to do a movie about three brothers making, or trying to make a
spiritual quest through India?

Mr. WES ANDERSON: Well, you know, my first thought with this movie was to
make a movie in India, which was inspired, really, by movies that I loved that
were set in India, in particular, the films of Satyajit Ray. But, for me,
where the project really started was when I had the idea to work with Jason
Schwartzman and Jason's cousin, my friend Roman, Roman Coppola, on the script.
When the three of us got together and we took our own journey through India
traveling in a train around Rajasthan and going up to the Himalayas, that
became the sort of subject matter for the film.

GROSS: What struck you both most about the differences between the trains in
India that you were riding and, say, Amtrak?

Mr. ANDERSON: Well, the train--you know, it's funny, because I actually like
to ride trains so I've traveled on trains in lots of different countries, and
the train in the movie, we used one of the kind of standard trains that we
rented from the government, from the ministry of trains in India, but we sort
of made it into a combination of all the trains all over the world that I've
traveled on. So the train in the movie is sort of an imaginary version of an
Indian train. It's decorated by artisans that we met there and sort of all
things we discovered in India, but the design of it kind of combines things
from all over the world.

GROSS: Wes Anderson, one of the things I really love about your movies is
that you make movies that are comedies but about people who are damaged or
lost, as the three brothers are in your new movie. And I guess, this is a
pretty broad question, but can you talk about making comedies about people who
are a little bit broken?

Mr. ANDERSON: You know, I don't have any interest in telling stories about
very happy, well-adjusted people. It doesn't seem that appealing to me, and
the damaged people usually seem funnier and also more sympathetic, so that may
be where I'm at. And also, in the case of a movie like this, we wanted this
movie to be as personal as it could possibly be. That was sort of our credo
while we were writing it together. Anytime we needed an answer for what
happens next in the story or how does a character respond, we tried to just
say, well, what has happened to you?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Mm-hmm.

Mr. ANDERSON: And I guess, when we did that, they end up being very damaged
characters.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: That...

GROSS: Can you each tell me a story that came out of your lives and ended up
in the film?

Mr. ANDERSON: I can think of some right off the bat, but I don't want to say
them on the air.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Whoa, whoa...

Mr. ANDERSON: Or I would say, for instance in the case of the character that
Jason plays, Jack is his character's name, his character has sort of arrived
in India having just come out of a sort of doomed romance that he's still kind
of reeling from. And I think--I mean, that in particular, I think both of us
relate to that character.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Definitely.

Mr. ANDERSON: Yeah.

GROSS: The three brothers are on camera at the same time during a lot of the
movie, and they're each reacting differently to what's going on around them,
so often there's like three brothers, their faces are in camera, it's close-up
on their faces, and they each have a different facial reaction to what's
happening. So I'd like, Wes, for you first to talk about framing that, and
then Jason, for you to talk about knowing that so much of the movie is taking
place on your face.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Mm-hmm.

GROSS: Wes, your turn.

Mr. ANDERSON: Yes, well, you know, the way we shot most of this movie, and I
think the way I usually like to sort of start when we're approaching a scene
is I'd rather figure out how can we do it without cutting. You know, it's
more fun for me to do it that way, and also it lets the actors play the scene
all the way through. And what you end up with is usually something where you
can kind of--where it feels like they're really doing it. They're really
playing the scene like they're on a stage or like it's in real life, one or
the other or some mixture of those things.

I think the end result is that they're often kind of, you know--the control
you lose when you do that is you can't pick a moment from this close-up and a
moment that close-up. You've got to just choose a take of the whole scene,
and it often kind of has a slightly more homemade feeling, and anyway, that's
the way I like to do it. And so you end up--but in the case of this movie,
you often see all three of them together in the shot and they're each doing
their own thing. They're making their contribution. I, you know, just stand
back and watch.

GROSS: Jason...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah?

GROSS: ...can you talk about knowing how much of the movie is about close-ups
of your face along with the two actors playing your brothers?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Well, I will say one thing and I don't know if this answers
the question or not, but I found that most of the experiences that were
happening to the characters in the movie felt or seemed almost identical to
the ones we were having as real people there at the time, live. So these are
three brothers, three American brothers, in an exotic country, in India, and
so were we three actors in an exotic country, in India. And so a lot of the
times it was fun for me, I suppose, because when I would look up at Adrien's
smile, not only am I thinking, you know, what the character is thinking and
going, `Wow, I can't believe this,' I'm also feeling that way as a person,
`Wow, I'm here, we here. Can you believe that we're here together?' And all
of us are, I think, are reacting in a very live, real way and that's what I
can say about having a close-up on my face. Just that that's the way--I
never--it always felt real to me to have the camera there capturing us because
we really were there having those experiences. I know that's kind of a vague
or weird answer, but that was my gut reaction to how to answer your question.

But I also will say it was a very small train compartment, just to add to what
Wes was saying, and having all three brothers in the shots seemed like the
most fun and logical way to do it, and it feels cramped. And it's all three
actors trying to find a way into the shot, you know; it was very tight. There
was very little room for anyone else but the three actors. And so we move in
very interesting and funny ways just to even stay in frame. But again, not an
answer to your question. My apologies.

GROSS: My guests are Jason Schwartzman and Wes Anderson. They're co-writers
of the new film "The Darjeeling Limited," which Schwartzman co-stars in and
Anderson directed. More after a break. This is FRESH AIR.

(Announcements)

GROSS: If you're just joining us, my guests is Wes Anderson and Jason
Schwartzman, and Anderson directed the new film "Darjeeling Limited." Jason
Schwartzman is one of the stars. They both co-wrote the film with Jason's
cousin Roman Coppola.

Jason, I read that Wes Anderson asked all the characters to dress themselves
so that they'd feel more authentic as the characters. So, Jason, what did
that mean for you and for your character? What did you decide to where? How
did you decide to, you know, dress yourself?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Right.

GROSS: Yeah.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Well, perhaps it would be better phrased to say that we as
actors were encouraged to get dressed ourselves. The costumes were already
decided upon by Wes and--yeah, by Wes. But we were encouraged, and we just
did, every morning, put on our own clothes that we wear in the movie, our
costumes, at our hotel. And we would all ride to work in our outfits so that
right when we got--and we would do our own hair, you know--well, for me that's
really just parting it--but I would do my own hair in the morning, put on my
suit, and I would go to work in my outfit, and the three actors all would do
that and we wouldn't bring really much on the train. And that's really just,
it really helped me. Just, I lived in my suit.

And you know, often times I'd come home after work and I wouldn't take it off.
I loved wearing it. And how the schedule would be is on Sunday night a little
man would knock on my door and hand me my suit, and I'd wear that for four
days and then there'd be another knock and I'd switch it out with another one.
And all the microphones were built into the suits, and all of it just to be
efficient and have fun.

Mr. ANDERSON: Yeah, that might not sound like an unusual thing in general
for somebody to dress--to put their clothes...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah. Oh yeah.

Mr. ANDERSON: ...on themselves in the morning. But on most movies, you
know...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah.

Mr. ANDERSON: ...the actors go to the set, they go to a trailer, they put on
their costume. They just sit in a makeup chair. They get their hair done.
And that was just--on this movie we didn't do that, which turned out to be so
much faster...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: It was great.

Mr. ANDERSON: ...and simpler, and you start to wonder why it was ever done
any other way.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah. I loved my...

GROSS: Did you do it that way for expediency or for getting more...

Mr. ANDERSON: I wanted...

GROSS: ...more like interacting?

Mr. ANDERSON: Well, I wanted to do it that way because I don't like
trailers. You know, then you're doing a scene and they go to the trailer and
they turn on ESPN, and then you call them and want them to come to play the
scene but the game is almost over.

GROSS: Yeah.

Mr. ANDERSON: And, you know, it's very tough to compete with, you know,
sports. And so I--and really...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: And isolation.

Mr. ANDERSON: And isolation. So what I think--you know, we just--I think
what, really, my goal was to try to create a situation where the actors really
feel as much as possible like the characters and they're in it together, and
they wanted to do that.

GROSS: And I was also surprised, you know, a movie about brothers and Owen's
in it and Luke isn't, you know. They were both in, for instance, "The Royal
Tenenbaums."

Mr. ANDERSON: Right. Yeah, well, you know. I thought about--you know, I
have something else I've been thinking of for Luke. And I thought about Luke
for it. In a way, I guess, because they are brothers, I kind of felt like it
wouldn't be, that maybe I shouldn't do it, cast them as brothers. And I don't
know exactly why I felt that way but you know, I mean, I always think of Luke
for parts and, yeah, I've had Luke in lots of movies, and you know, want to do
more--of course, want to do more movies with Luke. And just, in the case with
this one--in a way, I guess it was, just, I just, you know, the way I saw
these characters was different. I just thought this one character was perfect
for Adrien, this character was perfect for Jason and this character was
written for Owen.

GROSS: I have a couple of questions about Owen Wilson, and I don't want to
invade his privacy. I don't think these questions will, but if I'm wrong,
just stop me.

Mr. ANDERSON: OK.

GROSS: OK? Everyone, even just seeing the ads of the trailers for "The
Darjeeling Limited" knows that Owen Wilson's character has his head bandaged,
and his head is bandaged and banged up through the movie and it's because his
character has been in a motorcycle accident. And the accident may actually be
a suicide. Did you write this for him knowing that he had that possibility
within him?

Mr. ANDERSON: Oh, no. Not in any way. I mean, it's--you know, of course
not. I mean, I don't want to speak for Owen, because I think he'll--you know,
you'll have an interview with him and he'll just speak for himself much better
than I can. But, you know, that character, I mean, I, you know, I--that--in
"The Royal Tenenbaums" there's a suicide attempt that's, you know, a big part
of the movie which Luke Wilson plays, and I think those scenes come from my
fascination. And it's, you know, something to do with me, which I couldn't
even begin to explain, but it doesn't have anything to do with Owen.

GROSS: You're an old friend of Owen Wilson's. You were college friends.
You've lived together for years. What do you like about working with him as
an actor?

Mr. ANDERSON: Well, you know, Owen is--first of all, Owen, you know, we're
best friends. We're peers. But at the same time, in a way, I mean, I sort of
think of Owen in some ways as a sort of--I mean, I don't want to be too
generous to him, but he's a bit mentorish for me. You know, he had a very--he
had sort--I think we both--I mean, I think we've learned a lot from each other
over the years, but right at the beginning, I think he had certain--he had
experience that I hadn't. And you know, we wrote--we helped each other with
short stories. That was the first kind of creative work we did together on
our own, separate stories but kind of advising each other. And you know, he's
a good writer and he helped me figure some things out for myself.

He's, as many people know, I mean, he's very funny. He's one of the funniest
guys I've ever met. So I think--you know, and then, I cast him in a play when
we were in college together. And I can't--and not--he'd never acted in
anything before. There was no reason to even think that, but he was somebody
where he was, you know, captivating to listen to. And I remember my brother
came to see the play and he loved--he'd never met Owen and he loved him. He
thought he was--you know, he responded to Owen like Owen was a movie star.

GROSS: Like, how many siblings do you each have?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Well, in my family, after a couple of marriages and things
like that...

GROSS: Yeah, right.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: There's five of us, and I'm second to last.

GROSS: And is there a pecking order that came from that? Was that
significant at all?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: In my own family? Well, you know, my--John and Stephanie,
who are the oldest of my siblings are enough of an age difference where, as I
was growing up, they were off to college. So in my household, there was my
older brother, Matthew, myself and my younger brother, Robert.

GROSS: Was the sibling dynamic a big issue in your life--where you were
agewise with your siblings, Wes?

Mr. ANDERSON: With me? Well, I also, like Jason, am one of three brothers.
I have a younger sister, also, who's quite a bit younger, so you know, when I
was a kid I was in a house with three brothers. I'm the middle brother, which
Jason...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah.

Mr. ANDERSON: ...in a way is, too.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: I'm in a middle brother.

Mr. ANDERSON: Owen is also a middle brother. You know, I think in the '70s
they made a big thing out of the middle child. I think, you know, you were
kind of allowed to feel sorry for yourself. Somehow it was meant to be really
bad luck. But I, you know, I'm very interested in a brother relationship just
because it was such a big part of my life, and, you know, my brothers, we,
like all brothers, were fighting all the time when we were kids, but they're
the people I'm closest to in the world. And it's, you know, it's a dynamic
I'm very comfortable with.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Well, I was just going to say, too, the thing that I
noticed about brothers and age differences is you always seemed to be missing
each other in certain points of your life. I mean, one brother wants to be
really close with the other one but, because of an age difference, the other
one doesn't want to be close to the other. You know, you guys are best
friends growing up and then one goes into seventh grade and then one stays
home behind in elementary school, and, you know, the younger one still wants
to be friends but then the older one, you know, has got a whole new life, you
know. I go to a place now where I can buy a soda and you can't, you know.
And then they both get to school. And one gets a license so you're constantly
being divided by your age, but it's so close.

And then, like Wes said, they are the people you're closest to the most and
you love each other so much that that allows you to fight in a whole 'nother
way. And that's what, I think in this movie, is interesting, is that when you
watch it, though they fight and they bicker, I think it's really nice to see
that you can tell they really--they do love each other, and they struggle to
love each other. And that's what makes it funny and tense, I think. Next
question, please.

GROSS: Wes, I have one more question about Owen Wilson and, again, you're
free to answer it or not, but...

Mr. ANDERSON: OK.

GROSS: I just feel like I should ask it and...

Mr. ANDERSON: OK.

GROSS: I guess I should start this question by expressing my sympathy for you
in the sense that someone you're so close to has not, you know, had...

Mr. ANDERSON: Had an episode--yeah.

GROSS: ...been so close to death and is now, you know, hopefully making a
full recovery from that, but have you been in touch with him, and do you think
he will be well enough and willing to act again? Do you think you will...

Mr. ANDERSON: Oh, that.

GROSS: ...working with him again?

Mr. ANDERSON: Of course.

GROSS: Good.

Mr. ANDERSON: Yeah. And you know, I think there's a great deal of
misinformation which I'm not going to clear up because I think it's better if
he just clears it up himself, but people just have absolutely no idea. He was
never--I think that close to death is not very accurate description of what he
experienced. And, you know, I talk to him all the time. I was with him very
recently, and he's, you know, following what's going on with our movie. He's
just, you know, not, you know, he's not available to be out there. You know,
we have to really promote this and he can't be a part of that right now. But
he's, you know, we'll be seeing lots more work from him in the future.

GROSS: Jason Schwartzman and Wes Anderson. Their film "The Darjeeling
Limited" opens Friday. They'll talk about their film "Rushmore" in the second
half of the show. I'm Terry Gross, and this is FRESH AIR.

(Announcements)

GROSS: This is FRESH AIR. I'm Terry Gross back with Wes Anderson and Jason
Schwartzman. They're co-writers of the new film "The Darjeeling Limited,"
which Schwartzman co-stars in and Anderson directed. They first worked
together in the 1998 film "Rushmore," which was Schwartzman's first film role.

Wes Anderson, you cast Jason Schwartzman in your second film, "Rushmore," and
Jason, you played somebody in a prep school who gets a crush on one of the
teachers and sees Bill Murray, who's this like wealthy father of one of the
other kids in the school, as a surrogate father, the kind of father...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Mm-hmm.

GROSS: ...he wishes he had who is, I think...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Mm-hmm.

GROSS: ...powerful and wealthy, because his own father's a barber. And
you're terrific in the performance...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Oh, thank you.

GROSS: And let's start with how you were cast in the role. Jason, tell us
your version and then we'll ask Wes for his.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: How far back would you like me to go?

GROSS: How many years? I mean, how long is this story?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: I think...

Mr. ANDERSON: Don't you want to walk in the room, for your audition?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yes, here you go.

GROSS: Actually before you give us your answer, let me saw that I'm pretty
sure that Davia Nelson, who is known to a...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yes.

GROSS: ...lot of public radio listeners as one of The Kitchen Sisters, was
actually a significant part...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Well...

GROSS: ...of the story...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah.

GROSS: ...of how you were cast in "Rushmore."

Mr. ANDERSON: Take it from Davia then.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Watch this one. Watch this one. So I'm at this party in
Northern California. Davia Nelson is at the party. I didn't know who Davia
was at the time, but I think that she was friends with my family and, anyway,
got to talking with...

GROSS: And she was also a casting director--she was and is also a casting
director in addition to...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yes. Yes.

GROSS: ...to her radio work.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yes. And she was at this party, and my cousin Sofia
actually was talking to her and they were catching up on each other's lives,
and Sofia asked Davia what she was doing and she said she was casting a film
called "Rushmore." And Sofia asked what it was about and Davia said, you know,
`It's about a high school student who's a playwright,' and Sofia said, `Oh
well, you should,' you know, `that sounds like my cousin Jason.' Because I had
wanted to be--I had written a play and tried to direct a play also and all
this stuff. And she said, `Oh, I would love to meet him. Where is here?' And
she said, `He's actually here.'

And Sofia and Davia beckoned me, they called me over, and I said hello, and I
believe I actually had rented a tuxedo with tails and I had a top hat and
cane, I think, because I was flamboyant and insecure as a teenager. And
anyway, Davia told me that she was casting a film called "Rushmore" and would
I like to audition. She said I might be right for the part or something. And
I had told her that that was very nice, but I wasn't an actor. I didn't know
how to act and it perhaps could be a waste of everyone's time. After a couple
of back and forths of that, she sent me a script--she sent the script of
"Rushmore" to my house. It was the first script I ever read, and I must say
that I really--I loved it. And I thought it was hysterical and I never
thought I would be in the movie, and I was happy for whoever was going to be
the character.

Anyways, I called the LA casting office. They told me what the address was.
It was at Larchmont. I asked them what to wear. They told me that I should
just wear whatever made me comfortable. I realized that I would never be
comfortable, so I decided to go all out and put together the outfit that the
character wears in the movie, which is khakis and a blazer and everything. I
made my own patch with my friend Mike. We velcroed it onto my suit and I went
to the audition--I skipped school and I went to the audition, and I walked in
and there was Wes Anderson sitting in the room to read me, and I must say that
there was an instant feeling of relaxation that came over my body when I saw
Wes, being so young and seeming like he could be my friend. He seemed like
someone that I could be--and we instantly started talking with and it was so
much fun. And after that--then I auditioned and then Wes takes it from here.

Mr. ANDERSON: And well, I would just say that--I don't have a lot to add
beyond that, because what my experience was, he walked into the room with his
patch velcroed onto his blazer, and I think I kind of knew he was cast within
10 seconds, like the second I--as soon as I started talking to him, I thought,
`oh, well, this must be the guy.' And then he read the scenes--he read a
couple of scenes of the thing. He was perfect. I told him to walk around the
block while I read the last auditions I would do, which were the ones, the
other people waiting in the other room because I knew once I finished them I
was not going to have to look at anybody again. Then he came back and then he
read opposite these twins, or these two brothers who were going to play Bill
Murray's twin sons and he read Bill Murray's part opposite them in their
audition, and he was great in Bill Murray's part, too.

GROSS: Let's hear a scene from the film. And this takes place in-- Jason
Schwartzman is in the passenger seat of, the back seat of Bill Murray's car,
and remember, Bill Murray is kind of would-be surrogate father in this. It's
the father he wishes he had. But Bill Murray--Schwartzman has just found out
that Bill Murray is having an affair with the teacher at the prep school, the
teacher that Schwartzman is in love with. So he's really upset at Bill Murray
having this affair. And so here he is, here's Jason Schwartzman in the car,
expressing his anger to Bill Murray.

(Soundbite of "Rushmore")

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Max) How was she, Herman?

Mr. BILL MURRAY: (As Herman) Jesus Christ.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Max) Was she good? I'll bet she was. Although I
wouldn't know because I never...(word censored by station)...her.

(Soundbite of sniffle)

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Max) Going skinny dipping while I took a nap. `Are you
comfortable, Max? I'll just be out back nude getting...(word censored by
station)...from the woman you love.'

Mr. MURRAY: (As Herman) We never went skinny dipping.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Max) Sure you didn't. And next you're going to tell me
you didn't just walk out of her house at 2:00 in the morning.

Mr. MURRAY: (As Herman) I'm in love with her.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Max) I was in love with her first. And all that crap
about, `I don't think she's that great. I don't think she's right for you,
Max'? That was all bull...(word censored by station)...wasn't it? Do you
think she's in love with you?

Mr. MURRAY: (As Herman) I don't know.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: (As Max) Well, I guarantee you she's not and she never will
be.

(End of soundbite)

GROSS: That's Jason Schwartzman and Bill Murray in a scene from "Rushmore."
My guests are Jason Schwartzman and Wes Anderson, who directed that film and
the new film "Darjeeling Limited."

So, Wes Anderson, directing somebody as eccentric as Bill Murray with somebody
as new to acting as Jason Schwartzman, was that difficult to balance?

Mr. ANDERSON: No. You know, we had a great time making that movie. You
know, Jason and I rehearsed for some months...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah.

Mr. ANDERSON: ...before the movie, so we knew each other well, and he knew
his character very well. And so we were very comfortable together. Bill, I
had met once, and he arrived the day before we got to work. We got to know
Bill then, and then later I--you know, I think I've done four movies with Bill
Murray now. But, you know, there was just a short process of us kind of
figuring out who we were, you know, how we were going to interact, what we
thought of each other...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Mm-hmm.

Mr. ANDERSON: And once that occurred, I think we were kind of set to work
together for years.

GROSS: Jason Schwartzman, did Bill Murray give you any advice? Because he
was the pro, you were the newcomer?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: I will give you some advice that Bill gave to me. One
night to have like a kind of a toast, like a kickoff, friendship working
together toast, we went down to the hotel bar after dinner and Bill ordered
three Fernet-Brancas, which was a bitter drink that I'd never heard of before,
probably because it's a strange drink and also because I was 17. And then we
had these three Fernet-Brancas, and Bill said, `this is good to drink because
it digests it from the top.' And I never forgot that one.

Mr. ANDERSON: Digests it from the top.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: That's what he said. Digests it from the top, yeah.

GROSS: What does that mean?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: I think it means like, it's after, you know, it's a
digestif?

Mr. ANDERSON: Yeah.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah. So after you've eaten, it helps--it's like medicine.
It tastes like medicine. It works like medicine.

Mr. ANDERSON: Yeah.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: It digests it from the--it helps you digest but from the
top.

Mr. ANDERSON: Yeah.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: And then he also gave me a piece of advice that I never
really have understood, which I said, `How do you know, Bill, when you're in
your character?' You know, he said, `How much do you weigh?' I said, `I don't
know. One hundred and forty pounds.' He said, `Do you feel 140 pounds in your
feet?' And I said, `No.' And he goes, `When you do, then you'll know.'

GROSS: Wow, that's elliptical.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah, sure is.

Mr. ANDERSON: Digest it from the top and feel it in your feet.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: That's right.

GROSS: Yeah, well, how helpful is that?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Quite. I think about it a lot actually when I'm working.

GROSS: My guests are actor and writer Jason Schwartzman and director and
screenwriter Wes Anderson. They've worked together on the new film "The
Darjeeling Limited" and the 1998 film "Rushmore." More after a break. This is
FRESH AIR.

(Announcements)

GROSS: My guests are actor and writer Jason Schwartzman and director and
screenwriter Wes Anderson. They've worked together on the new film "The
Darjeeling Limited" and the 1998 film "Rushmore."

Jason, how much did you grow up on movie sets? You know, your mother is Talia
Shire, who was...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Mm-hmm.

GROSS: She was the godfather's daughter, Michael Corleone's sister in "The
Godfather," Rocky's girlfriend. I mean, so, did you grow up around movie
sets?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Rocky's wife.

GROSS: Rocky's wife, well. Sorry. Yeah.

Mr. ANDERSON: I was going to say...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: No, I'm just kidding. To be honest, my memories--I have
very little memories of growing up on movie sets. It felt like my mom was
around a lot when I was growing up. I don't think she worked as much when my
younger brother and I were born, so of course she--I went a couple times, I
think, to the set of "Rocky III," maybe, and we did go to Italy for "The
Godfather III," but not for long periods of time. I wasn't a kid who really
grew up on movie sets at all. I did not have that kind of life. My mom was
very--kept that away from us.

Mr. ANDERSON: Wasn't there a BMX movie or something...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah.

Mr. ANDERSON: ...that you were on a lot?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. There was a movie that my father
produced and my mom was in that was called "Rad" that was the BMX biking movie
that I actually loved, and that I got to hang around a lot on. But I don't
have very many memories. I had a very un-Hollywood childhood, as far as I was
concerned.

GROSS: So, you know, so many of us first encountered you from "Rushmore."
Briefly, what were you like in high school?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: I was an A-plus student, and my personal feeling was that I
felt kind of alienated or that girls--I seemed to be like girls' best friend.
I didn't ever seem to be the one they wanted. They always like wanted my
friends, and I was the go-between giving them messages. But I personally was
down on myself about like how I was doing with girls. I just was pretty
insecure as a high school student, probably.

Mr. ANDERSON: You were a high school rock star. What are you talking about?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah, OK. My high school years. I just, I had a really
good time in high school.

Mr. ANDERSON: But don't, I mean...(unintelligible).

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: I was very popular, straight A student. I was a jock, lead
guitar player in the jazz band. No, but I would say that my time in high
school, I had great friends and I got along pretty well with everybody, and
mostly I just tried to get good grades and talk, you know, have confidence to
talk to girls and stuff. I was really consumed, I think, with that kind of
stuff. But I...

GROSS: Now, you were in a band.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: kind of do all right.

GROSS: You were in a band in high school? or after?

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: In high school, yeah. We played my eighth grade
graduation. That was our first show.

Mr. ANDERSON: My take on what you were like in high school is I remember we
went over to shoot a scene with a classroom full of kids who you had never met
when we were doing "Rushmore"...

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Yeah.

Mr. ANDERSON: ...and basically every syllable that Jason uttered, the entire
classroom started laughing at. They were immediately all completely taken
with you. I think that might be a more accurate description of what you were
in like in high school from the point of view of somebody actually seeing you
or meeting you.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Right.

GROSS: Well, it's been great to talk to both of you. Good luck with the new
movie. And thanks a lot for talking with us.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Thanks.

Mr. ANDERSON: Thanks.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Oh, sorry, Wes. Go ahead.

Mr. ANDERSON: I was just going to say thank you.

Mr. SCHWARTZMAN: Thank you, Terry. Thank you very much, Terry.

GROSS: Wes Anderson directed and co-wrote the new film "The Darjeeling
Limited." Jason Schwartzman co-wrote it and co-stars in it. It opens Friday.
Schwartzman also has a new CD of his songs called "Coconut Records."

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Review: David Bianculli on his two favorite new shows for the
fall 2007 line-up, "Aliens in America" and "Pushing Daisies"
TERRY GROSS, host:

The fall TV season is officially in its second week on the broadcast networks.
Our TV critic, David Bianculli, says his two favorite new shows of the season
arrive this week. One tonight, the other on Wednesday.

DAVID BIANCULLI reporting:

Most of the new shows this season are trying--and failing--to recapture the
magic of recent hits. There are lots of romantic comedies with large
ensembles, trying to be either "Desperate Housewives" or "Grey's Anatomy." One
of them, ABC's "Big Shots," which premiered last week, even tries to be an
all-male "Sex in the City," with four attractive guys sitting around talking.
They're all instantly forgettable, so let's forget about them and move on.

The other big batch of wannabes features new shows that are trying to be like
either "Lost" or "Heroes." Here, the shows with the lighter touch,
specifically "Chuck" and "Reaper," come off the best and are fun to watch.
But their plots are so similar, they could almost swap casts or co-exist in
the same series. They're both about ordinary slacker guys with loyal, funny
best friends and low self-esteem who work in crummy sales jobs but suddenly
are hit with a life-changing experience. One has tons of top-secret spy
knowledge zapped into his brain, the other becomes the reluctant employee of
the devil. They're enjoyable, but they're not unique. Not even from each
other.

But my two favorite shows of the year, they're defiantly different. Tonight
on the CW network--you can find it if you look hard enough--is the premiere of
the sitcom "Aliens in America." Wednesday on ABC is the premier of a new
comedy drama, "Pushing Daisies," which has the most original series concept in
years.

"Aliens" first. Like "Everybody Hates Chris," which it follows, "Aliens in
America" is told from a teenager's point of view. Dan Byrd stars as Justin
Tolchock, a 16-year-old from Wisconsin whose first day of high school goes so
badly his parents decide to boost his popularity by sponsoring an exchange
student. They're expecting some blond Nordic hunk, like the one on the cover
of the guidance department brochure. What they get instead is Raja, a Muslim
exchange student from Pakistan. He's perfectly played by Adhir Kalyan. And
if Justin thought his first day of class went badly, listen to Raja's.

(Soundbite of "Aliens in America")

Unidentified Actress #1: (As teacher) Class, today I'm going to put aside our
lesson because we have a special guest. For one year we will be in the
presence of a real live Pakistani who practices Muslimism. That means we have
the opportunity to learn about his culture and he about ours. So let's be in
a dialogue.

Raja, you are so different from us. How does that feel?

Mr. ADHIR KALYAN: (As Raja) I am not sure I understand.

Actress #1: (As teacher) Mm-hmm. Think about it.

How does everyone else feel about Raja and his differences? Yes, Stephanie.

Unidentified Actress #2: (As student) Well, I guess I feel angry, because his
people blew up the buildings in New York.

Actress #1: (As teacher) Oh, that's good.

Mr. KALYAN: (As Raja) But that is not true.

Actress #1: (As teacher) OK, Raja, in America, you have to wait until you're
called on, and I'd appreciate a raised hand.

(End of soundbite)

BIANCULLI: Just to have a Muslim character at the center of a comedy is
daring right now. To have him be the most sympathetic one in the show, that's
almost subversive. But the lesson of tolerance delivered so lightly and
wittily doesn't that even seem like a lesson is less important here than the
fact that "Aliens in America," pure and simple, is a very funny show.

"Pushing Daisies," which premieres Wednesday, is a very weird show. It's so
strange it's difficult to describe, and my fear is, the more I try to describe
it, the stupider I make it sound. A lot of it is visual. Imagine a
modern-day fable that takes place in a neighborhood with the oversaturated
colors of Oz. So you'll just have to trust me until you see for yourself, but
please, do see for yourself.

Lots of talented people are involved with this show. The director of the
pilot of "Pushing Daisies" is Barry Sonnenfeld, of "The Addams Family" and
"Men in Black" films. The creator is Bryan Fuller, who made "Dead Like Me"
and "Wonderfalls." The supporting cast includes Swoosie Kurtz, Ellen Greene
and Kristen Chenoweth. The narrator is Jim Dale, who records the
books-on-tape versions of the "Harry Potter" novels. And the stars are Lee
Pace and Anna Friel, who play childhood sweethearts reunited after many years
apart. He's Ned, she's nicknamed Chuck, and the only problem is when they
reunite at a funeral home, she's already dead.

But that's just the start of this unique love story, because Ned has the power
to raise the dead. Here's where I worry about losing people. And it gets
even weirder because Ned's powers come with some very specific rules. Ned
touches something dead once, it comes back to life. He touches it again, it
dies forever. He lets it live more than a minute, and something else around
him dies.

(Soundbite of "Pushing Daisies")

Mr. LEE PACE: (As Ned) Chuck, wait!

Ms. ANNA FRIEL: (As Chuck) Who are you?

Mr. PACE: (As Ned) Do you remember a little boy who lived next door to you
when your dad died?

Ms. FRIEL: (As Chuck) Ned? Oh my God! Hey, how are you?

Mr. PACE: (As Ned) Good. You look great. Do you know what's happening
right now?

Ms. FRIEL: (As Chuck) I had the strangest dream. I was being strangled to
death with a plastic sack.

Mr. PACE: (As Ned) You were strangled to death with a plastic sack. That's
probably an odd thing to hear, but I wasn't quite sure how to sugarcoat it.

Ms. FRIEL: (As Chuck) Oh. Oh.

Mr. PACE: (As Ned) You only have a minute--less.

Ms. FRIEL: (As Chuck) What can I do in less than a minute?

Mr. PACE: (As Ned) You could tell me who killed you so, you know, justice
can be served.

Ms. FRIEL: (As Chuck) Well, that's really sweet, but I don't know who killed
me. I went to go get ice and I dropped my rumkin ice maker and as I was
thinking, `That was dumb'...

Mr. JIM DALE: As she was thinking that was dumb, Chuck was strangled to
death with a plastic sack.

(Soundbite of crash)

Ms. FRIEL: (As Chuck) And then you touched my cheek.

(Soundbite of knocking on door)

Unidentified Actor: What's going on here?

Mr. PACE: (As Ned) Just a second.

Ms. FRIEL: (As Chuck) Is my time up?

Mr. PACE: (As Ned) I'm sorry.

Ms. FRIEL: (As Chuck) Well, thanks for calling me Chuck. You know, no one's
called me Chuck since--since you.

Mr. PACE: (As Ned) I used to, when I lived next door to you. I had a cru--I
was in--you were my first kiss.

Ms. FRIEL: (As Chuck) Yeah? You were my first kiss, too. Do you want to be
my last kiss? First and last? Or is that weird?

Mr. PACE: (As Ned) That's not weird. It's magical.

(End of soundbite)

BIANCULLI: So that's the setup. If Ned kisses her, she's dead forever. If
he lets her live--and it wouldn't be much of a series if he didn't--he can
never kiss her or touch her again without killing her. It's the perfect
solution to the "Moonlighting" problem of will they or won't they? They
can't.

But can true love exist without physical contact? That's what "Pushing
Daisies" sets out to explore, along with questions about life and death and
what makes a really good pie.

In television, what makes a really good show--most of the time--is
originality. "Pushing Daisies," like "Aliens in America," serves up
originality in generous, yummy slices. Please try both. On this year's
prime-time menu of new shows, they're the only specials of the day that are
truly special.

GROSS: David Bianculli is TV critic for the New York Daily News.

Coming up, Kevin Whitehead reviews a new re-issue featuring trumpeter Lee
Morgan at the age of 18. This is FRESH AIR.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Review: Kevin Whitehead on a new re-issue of Lee Morgan trumpeting
at 18
TERRY GROSS, host:

Jazz trumpeter Lee Morgan played in Art Blakey's Jazz Messengers for three
years, starting in 1958. He had a jukebox hit in the mid-'60s with "The
Sidewinder," a jazz tune with a raucous boogaloo beat. In 1972 he was fatally
shot outside a New York night club. But before all that, jazz critic Kevin
Whitehead says, Morgan was a precocious teenager who played trumpet
ridiculously well. Kevin reviews a re-issue of music Morgan recorded at age
18.

(Soundbite of "Whisper Not")

KEVIN WHITEHEAD reporting:

That's Benny Golson's jazz standard "Whisper Not," recorded by Lee Morgan in
December of 1956. Back then it was a brand new tune, but Morgan took a solo
so assured and creative, he might have been playing it for years.

(Soundbite of "Whisper Not")

WHITEHEAD: Lee Morgan, showing that when you play the trumpet using a metal
Harmon, you don't have to sound like Miles Davis. Morgan was a protege of
Dizzy Gillespie and a great admirer of Clifford Brown, but this teenager
already had something of his own to say. Morgan's lines are supple and
lyrical, his rhythms dart this way and that, and I love that tuneful little
quote from "Pop Goes the Weasel."

"Whisper Not" comes from the new re-issue "Lee Morgan, Volume 2: Sextet" from
Blue Note. It's one more reminder what a golden age for jazz the 1950s was.

(Soundbite of "Latin Hangover")

WHITEHEAD: Tenor saxophonist Hank Mobley on Benny Golson's "Latin Hangover."
Golson wrote four of the six pieces on this album when he was just blossoming
as a writer of catchy melodies that improvisers love to dig into. The
sextet's pianist is Horace Silver, so one great jazz composer interprets
another. Paul Chambers is on bass, Charlie Persip's on drums, and
little-known Kenny Rogers gets a nice beefy sound on alto sax. But this date
really belongs to the leader. Even in a music blessed with trumpet prodigies,
Lee Morgan was extra special. His confidence and ability to improvise
striking phrases and string them into flowing statements would be
extraordinary even if he hadn't been 18 and still growing.

(Soundbite of music)

WHITEHEAD: Lee Morgan began recording only a month before this 1956 date, but
in the intervening 30 days, he'd done three Hank Mobley sessions and cut a
live album with Dizzy Gillespie's Big Band. Four months later he recorded
another sextet date, just back out as "Lee Morgan: Volume Three." There,
Benny Golson not only wrote the tunes, including a rapturous "I Remember
Clifford," but also plays excellent tenor saxophone. Though I'm a major
Golson fan, I like Morgan's blend with the gruff Hank Mobley here even better.
Still, it is a close call, and either way you get lots of Lee Morgan in the
1950s. It doesn't get much better than that.

(Soundbite of music)

GROSS: Kevin Whitehead teaches English and American Studies at the University
of Kansas and he's a jazz columnist for emusic.com.

I'm Terry Gross.
Transcripts are created on a rush deadline, and accuracy and availability may vary. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Please be aware that the authoritative record of Fresh Air interviews and reviews are the audio recordings of each segment.